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  ProbeTalk.com Forums > Tech Section > 2nd Gen (93-97) V6 2.5L > 2nd Gen (93-97) V6 2.5L Archive

2nd Gen (93-97) V6 2.5L Archive Quality Archived Posts and FAQs

 
 
November 30th, 2005, 10:40 AM   #1
RedLineGT
Jr. Member
 
: May 2005
: 33
: 138
Camber Adjustment?

I have a 93 Ford Probe GT, I put in Megan Racing 2 inch lowering springs....and now I think now my camber is off......I had brand new $120 tires put on the front and had an alignment and the inside edge has belt showing after only 5,000 miles. I very rarely burnout and its only the inside edge....so thats the camber right?......I see these camber kits for like $25 at NAPA but I dont what they do or how to adjust them.....do i Just put them in and then take it to garage and have em align everything?.....Thank You very much.....
 
November 30th, 2005, 12:04 PM   #2
KevinD
Moderator
 
 
: Feb 2004
: Eastern Washington State
: 11,627
What did the alignment shop say when you had it aligned?
Camber or toe errors can cause wear on the edge. And the PGT has an adjustable camber angle (2 steps: 0, +½º).
KevinD
__________________
1995 Sapphire Blue Mustang GT Convertible, 2006 Storm Red Metallic Mercedes-Benz CLK 350 Cabriolet, 2006 Dark Shadow Gray Ford F250 V10 Supercab 4x4, 2004 Perlite Gray Metallic Mercedes-Benz E320 4Matic, 2002 Burgundy Pearl Suzuki XL-7 Touring, 1971 Spring Green Jeep J4000 Gladiator, 1966 Signal Flare Red Ford Fairlane, to name a few...

 
November 30th, 2005, 12:11 PM   #3
JOSEPH PIERCE
PT Guru
 
: Sep 2003
: ROC NY
: 41
: 6,131
I just did the same thing with eibocs. Im on my 2nd pair in the front
thats what i get for driving without getting an alingment. Is there a way to bring the wheels in some before I get around to getting it aligned? I cant wait to see the inside of theese tires
__________________
94Gt Ze Rio red,afpr,borla, sts,EIBACHS
,gray->black int, mx6 leather,
need rio red sideskirts yesterday
Ze isnt rice its from JAP its a rice eater


My car is finally in the garage again

 
November 30th, 2005, 01:00 PM   #4
RedLineGT
Jr. Member
 
: May 2005
: 33
: 138
Idk

Yeah the aligment place didnt say nuttin, prolly cuz they wanted me to come back for new tires in 6 months....lol.....but i really just wanna fix the problem before i buy my winter tires....i think what i will do is buy the camber adjustment kit put it in to my best ability and bring it to have it all set and straight with new tire....another question is how come the back tires arent wearing the same....i know there not drive tires but they should still wear on the inside a little and they aint.....thank you
 
November 30th, 2005, 01:02 PM   #5
NickR
Senior Member
 
: Jul 2004
: Chelsea, Quebec, Canada
: 3,127
There's a great post here about how to do an alignment, it's from the suspension forum archive: http://forums.probetalk.com/showthread.php?t=1700991537
If you have two people, two short straight lengths of lumber (about 3 foot long) and a tape measure, you can measure the toe-in reasonably accurately. Hold each length of lumber horizontally against the outside of the wheel, about 6" off the ground. Meaure the distance between the two lengths of lumber, comparing just in front of the tire, with just behind the tire.
 
November 30th, 2005, 03:31 PM   #6
KevinD
Moderator
 
 
: Feb 2004
: Eastern Washington State
: 11,627
I did my own alignment once on a '75 Maverick, using a tape measure, a level and a framing square; it quit wearing out tires...
If the front tires are wearing and the rear tires aren't then it's probably more of a toe error than a camber error.
Normally, a "camber adjustment kit" is an offset bolt for the lower control arm mount that allows some camber to be cranked in from the bottom; it shouldn't be too difficult to install.
KevinD
__________________
1995 Sapphire Blue Mustang GT Convertible, 2006 Storm Red Metallic Mercedes-Benz CLK 350 Cabriolet, 2006 Dark Shadow Gray Ford F250 V10 Supercab 4x4, 2004 Perlite Gray Metallic Mercedes-Benz E320 4Matic, 2002 Burgundy Pearl Suzuki XL-7 Touring, 1971 Spring Green Jeep J4000 Gladiator, 1966 Signal Flare Red Ford Fairlane, to name a few...
 
November 30th, 2005, 04:53 PM   #7
JOSEPH PIERCE
PT Guru
 
: Sep 2003
: ROC NY
: 41
: 6,131
my tire if looking from the front / \ so its killing the inside. Is that toe? Thats fixed by the tie rods right?
__________________
94Gt Ze Rio red,afpr,borla, sts,EIBACHS
,gray->black int, mx6 leather,
need rio red sideskirts yesterday
Ze isnt rice its from JAP its a rice eater


My car is finally in the garage again

 
November 30th, 2005, 04:59 PM   #8
dmark101
Obfuscatory & Abstruse Nomenclature
 
 
: Jan 2000
: Location: Location:
: 34,511
the way you describe the tires sitting (/ \) is camber.

toe would look the same way if viewing the wheels from the top. i guess the best way to describe it is with the tires point either in toward each other > < or away from each other < >.
 
November 30th, 2005, 05:34 PM   #9
JOSEPH PIERCE
PT Guru
 
: Sep 2003
: ROC NY
: 41
: 6,131
:
the way you describe the tires sitting (/ \) is camber.
so its that fixed with the tie rods? or the camber kit? do I need the kit or can that be adjusted other ways?
__________________
94Gt Ze Rio red,afpr,borla, sts,EIBACHS
,gray->black int, mx6 leather,
need rio red sideskirts yesterday
Ze isnt rice its from JAP its a rice eater


My car is finally in the garage again

 
November 30th, 2005, 05:40 PM   #10
KevinD
Moderator
 
 
: Feb 2004
: Eastern Washington State
: 11,627
Tie rod ends affect the TOE, and camber adjustment affects the CAMBER. As I posted above, the Probe has a 2-step adjustment for the camber built-in
Check out the link NickR posted for a good explaination of the toe.
See this for a better understanding of the 3 suspension angles.
KevinD
__________________
1995 Sapphire Blue Mustang GT Convertible, 2006 Storm Red Metallic Mercedes-Benz CLK 350 Cabriolet, 2006 Dark Shadow Gray Ford F250 V10 Supercab 4x4, 2004 Perlite Gray Metallic Mercedes-Benz E320 4Matic, 2002 Burgundy Pearl Suzuki XL-7 Touring, 1971 Spring Green Jeep J4000 Gladiator, 1966 Signal Flare Red Ford Fairlane, to name a few...

 
November 30th, 2005, 05:52 PM   #11
JOSEPH PIERCE
PT Guru
 
: Sep 2003
: ROC NY
: 41
: 6,131
ok def getting it now lol thanks. where whould I find this 2 step process for camber. Haynes ?
__________________
94Gt Ze Rio red,afpr,borla, sts,EIBACHS
,gray->black int, mx6 leather,
need rio red sideskirts yesterday
Ze isnt rice its from JAP its a rice eater


My car is finally in the garage again

 
November 30th, 2005, 05:59 PM   #12
mac1
Probe has-been
 
 
: Jun 2001
: Phoenix
: 13,957
typical alignment mechanice hate to mess with your camber, they will lie and tell you you need control arms and springs or strut mounts rather then actually adjust them. FYI, changing camber changes caster and will immidietly change your toe dramatically.
Also if you buy camber bolts and replace one of the strut to spindel bolts(not sure which one), it will the give the mechanic an easier time adjusting camber for you.
__________________
1993 Mercury tRacer :Vitara & mFactory: was my #1
1994 Mercury TrAcer Wagon : '02 SPI swap : the loaner
2001 Hyundai Accent 2.0L-T3 swaphas flat pots
2014 Factory Five 818s EJ255t :it's adorable
2000 Lotus esprit v8TT : under the knife 2018
2003 Pathfinder 200k miles : The daily
No I do not Uber any of these

 
November 30th, 2005, 06:33 PM   #13
KevinD
Moderator
 
 
: Feb 2004
: Eastern Washington State
: 11,627
The front shock absorber upper mounting bracket studs on the front spring and shock are offset. Camber is adjusted by rotating the front shock absorber upper mounting bracket to one of the following 3 positions:

Camber Adjustment

Check camber against specifications. If necessary, set the camber as follows:

1. Raise the car by the body so the front suspension is unloaded.

2. Remove the tire and wheel assembly.

3. Loosen and remove the front shock absorber upper mounting bracket nuts.

4. Lower the front spring and shock and rotate the front shock absorber upper mounting bracket to the desired position.

5. Reinstall the front spring and shock.

6. Install and tighten the front shock absorber upper mounting bracket nuts.

7. Tighten the front shock absorber upper mounting bracket nuts to 46-63 N-m (34-46 lb-ft).

8. Ensure that camber was set correctly.

From the Ford Service Manual.

You can see why an average Front End Tech. won't want to mess with it.
BTW, 30' (30 minutes) is ½º.
KevinD
__________________
1995 Sapphire Blue Mustang GT Convertible, 2006 Storm Red Metallic Mercedes-Benz CLK 350 Cabriolet, 2006 Dark Shadow Gray Ford F250 V10 Supercab 4x4, 2004 Perlite Gray Metallic Mercedes-Benz E320 4Matic, 2002 Burgundy Pearl Suzuki XL-7 Touring, 1971 Spring Green Jeep J4000 Gladiator, 1966 Signal Flare Red Ford Fairlane, to name a few...

 
November 30th, 2005, 08:37 PM   #14
NickR
Senior Member
 
: Jul 2004
: Chelsea, Quebec, Canada
: 3,127
Very informative post, Kevin. I always wondered why the strut mounts were asymmetrical, so that the strut was not in the centre of the four mounting bolts. And I was reading threads in the "suspension" section, some of which said that camber and caster were adjustable, but I couldn't see any threads explaining how it was done (except by buying special parts, or drilling the mounting bolt holes into an oval shape). Both puzzles solved at once.

I found the following alignment specs for the MX6 and 626 (none for the Probe) on the Bradbury site:

:
Front Wheel Alignment - Toe-in - 3mm +3mm
Front Wheel Alignment - Camber - MX6: -0º 42' + 45'; 626: -0º 36' + 45'
Front Wheel Alignment - Caster - MX6: 3º 01' + 45'; 626: 2º 37' + 45'
Front Left/Right differences - Camber: 30' max, Caster: 45' max
Rear Wheel Alignment - Toe-in - 3mm + 3mm
Rear Wheel Alignment - Thrust Angle - 0º + 0.1º
I take it that means very slight (about half a degree) *negative* camber (wheels out at the bottom, and in at the top)? (Or is it a dash, not a minus sign?)

Did you use the spirit level and framing square to set the *camber* on your Maverick? My guess is that a plumb line might be more accurate.

Let's see, consulting my very old trigonometry tables from Hi Skool, tangent(36') (camber for my 626) is 0.01, so with 15" rims (probably 16" diameter at the "lip"), if I hold a plumb line against my rims, it should be 0.16" away from the top of the rim when it's touching the bottom of the rim. I reckon it should be possible to measure that within the +/-45' tolerance allowed in the specs. (But I must make sure the car is on level ground first, so I expect I will still need a spirit level.)

OK, I managed to measure and adjust my car's toe-in (damned rusted tie-rod end were the biggest problem -- I broke one spanner adjusting the lock nut). Now I think I've got my head around camber, and I think I could measure it and adjust it myself. Castor....oh dear: I know what it is, and I think I now know how to adjust it, but how can you possibly measure it?

edited for clarity KevinD

 
November 30th, 2005, 08:56 PM   #15
KevinD
Moderator
 
 
: Feb 2004
: Eastern Washington State
: 11,627
With an alignment machine...

Yes, those are negative numbers (negative camber=top of wheel tilted inward)
The MX-6 numbers are the same as the 2.0L Probe; the only difference is the 2.5L Probe has a camber spec. of 0º 54' + 45'.
KevinD
__________________
1995 Sapphire Blue Mustang GT Convertible, 2006 Storm Red Metallic Mercedes-Benz CLK 350 Cabriolet, 2006 Dark Shadow Gray Ford F250 V10 Supercab 4x4, 2004 Perlite Gray Metallic Mercedes-Benz E320 4Matic, 2002 Burgundy Pearl Suzuki XL-7 Touring, 1971 Spring Green Jeep J4000 Gladiator, 1966 Signal Flare Red Ford Fairlane, to name a few...

 
December 1st, 2005, 10:23 AM   #16
jjjxlr8pgt
Member
 
: Sep 2005
: Findlay, OH
: 366
Assuming that you don't have any worn out suspension components / bushings, I doubt that your problem is strictly camber. It sounds like you have a toe-out problem.

I have been running -2.7 degrees negative camber in the front of my '96 pgt for 3 years and have never had any problem with the inside shoulder of my tires. I have my toe set to zero.

If you have negative camber and a little toe out (it doesn't take much at all!), the inside shoulders of your tires will wear quickly.
 
 

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