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  • #16
    Originally posted by Winter.Raven
    Oh yeah....and today I also put on the MBX FPR kit. Mike.....seriously...can we do something about pre-made lines? I STILL have metal wire from the lines in my fingers. It was a serious PITA to get all the fittings on there....but man....it looks nice....real nice, especially with the IM.....YUMMY

    I hear ya on that one. Jeez my hands got all bloody with those sharp metal edges, and then i couldn't get the metal parts in the fittings completely after like a couple hours. Got one of them in, the rest look all frayed but whatever, i'm just hoping they hold tightly lol. Premade lines woulda been rly nice ( or something to make the fitment issue alot easier.)
    Boosting...

    "The importance of automobiles in our lives secures their place in the lore of our times. They are both practical and whimsical, reliable and frightening, mundane and exciting, necessary and exotic, commonplace and mysterious. They are, in other words, the mechanical expression of humanity. "

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Jeff L
      Snailman....easy on ripping someone you don't have a clue about. While of course it looks rough, all of his time was spent on engine simulation software to maximize power throughout the band, and then flowbenching the prototype for even flow on all cylinders. Which is more than ANY other intake maker has ever done in those departments.
      For some reason I highly doubt that.

      Second, "engine simulation software" (whatever that means) would only be useful for testing a design, not making a good design. I highly doubt he knows anything about viscous fluids, CFD, pipe flow, or acoustics.

      Even flow on a bench has little to do with how well it will perform in UNSTEADY conditions (an engine running).

      Anyway, I'll save my criticisms for another thread, I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade.
      '96 MX-6 LS V6 M/T KL-ZE / '93 MX-6 LS V6 A/T [R.I.P.]
      '93 MX-6 LS V6 M/T KL-ZE [R.I.P.] / '94 Mazda 626 LS V6 M/T [R.I.P.]
      http://www.cardomain.com/id/snailman153624

      MY EMAIL ADDRESS IS NOT WORKING!

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Winter.Raven
        POWER? Here is everyones favorite question. Will it make POWER? Well....I have a straight up, REAL anwser. Yes. It does. I would guess around 15-20 hp starting at around 4000 rpms. I can definatly feel the difference, and I dont even have a perfect fit yet. I am sure I am losing a lot of power with my major leak. Better then POWER...is the ride itself. My car is infinatley smoother now. There are no jerks in the power band, it just feels strong and smooth the whole way up until redline. We will get it on a dyno when install is done 100% and I can idle
        Originally posted by Winter.Raven
        Now, by affecting the smoothness of the ride, im talking about the powerband, if that makes sense. its kind of a constant sucking you into your seat feeling instead of just a short one on take off. at about 4000 rpms you definatly feel the take off. It takes less then three seconds to go from 60mph-80 mph in 4th gear. 5th gear was kind of wierd. I kinda felt like a power loss. Usually I can ride 5ht at 30 mph and feel power gain. When I switched over from 4th to 5th at 70 mph(about 3000 rpms), it felt like i wasnt gaining speed. I was, but not very quickly. it took about 2 seconds per 10mph until around 4300 rpms. Once I hit 4300 rpms, it kicked in....when it reached higher int he rpms I did a 100-140 mph in about 3 seconds. This power loss could easily be due to my leak. But I wanted to know how it felt for daily driving. Like I said, I cant idle, so driving is HARD....hopefully it will be fixed in a few hours
        I'll just tell you right now that, that is exactly what that manifold is going to do. Long runners on the IM help the motor make low end power by creating more intake charge velocity and momentum. This is good for the daily driver, which is what most of ours cars are and what most car manufactures have in mind when making cars, even quick little sport compacts. Look at any race car and you'll see large short runners, this is great for top end, and how much of our motors life is spent above 5 grand? Id say somewhere around 1-2%... So lets all thank MAZDA for designing an IM that suits us for the daily drive but at the same time makes more than decent power up top. That said, there's no "jerks" in a car with propery opperating VRIS. A KL manifold dyno has more of a plato looking power curve, a manifold like the CZT design acomplishes 1 thing, high end power. That dyno's going to look like a ramp, power is going to start low and stay low until about 4 grand and is just going to be killer around 6500rpm. So don't be surprized when power is non-existant below 3grand, thats just the real character of a short runner IM. On the same hand don't be surprised when your car screams above 4500rpm
        Matt Hicks
        Silver 97 2.0 Turbo
        Factory Green ZX6RR
        If you have 1,000 posts and have not donated to PT, you should consider doing so.
        "We're all still learning."

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        • #19
          Second, "engine simulation software" (whatever that means) would only be useful for testing a design, not making a good design. I highly doubt he knows anything about viscous fluids, CFD, pipe flow, or acoustics.
          I agree that the statement "Which is more than ANY other intake maker has ever done in those departments." is a bit high handed. However, simulation and dynamics software is rather easy to acquire and is capable of utilizing input and output data to calculate nearly anything you would want to consider. If you want to learn then you can. No one can stop you.

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          • #20
            when it reached higher int he rpms I did a 100-140 mph in about 3 seconds

            this MUST be a typo!
            2004 Dodge SRT-4
            Mopar Stage 3 + bolt-ons - 400+ whp , Best 1/4 mile - 11.5 at 129 mph (1.97 60 ft)

            1994 PGT KLZE
            ,
            Seli Cams, Megasquirt, 2.5 exhaust, hotshot headers, etc, etc, 190+WHP RIP

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            • #21
              Yea Rob is going to be doing the other orders very soon.
              "With A turbo, exhaust gasses go into the turbocharger and spin it, With a supercharger, air goes in,witchcraft happens and you go faster"
              -Jeremy Clarkson


              D'Jasper Probincrux III - South Carolina State University

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              • #22
                Originally posted by snailman153624
                For some reason I highly doubt that.

                Second, "engine simulation software" (whatever that means) would only be useful for testing a design, not making a good design. I highly doubt he knows anything about viscous fluids, CFD, pipe flow, or acoustics.

                Even flow on a bench has little to do with how well it will perform in UNSTEADY conditions (an engine running).
                Believe it or not, you're wrong. "You highly doubt it" vs. I knew him when both of us lived in Indy. I actually lived with he and his wife for a little bit. You don't have the firsthand knowledge that I do. You never saw his setup, saw how he designed it, saw his efforts, talked to him, etc. So don't give me the "shaking head" icon and assume things because it leads me to believe you're a huge jackass.

                I also think you're confusing my support of the design with supporting what CZT did to the community. They're completely separate. You're kinda treating me like I'm guilty by association or something. All I'm saying is Winter's intake is cool, and I'm happy that he's having a blast with it, and that it's a solid design....congratulations. That type of thing. Not trying to have an argument. But you've got to quit assuming before you start ripping.






                Originally posted by ZiMX3
                I agree that the statement "Which is more than ANY other intake maker has ever done in those departments." is a bit high handed.
                I should've specified...I was referring to PMO b/c they're the only other people that have attempted to mass-produce intakes. They had the billet hype going for them and that was about it. No research, no numbers, no performance design. Just mechanical design.
                redeemed
                IndyProbes founder

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                • #23
                  I agree with Jeff; I spoke to Rob a couple dozen times over an interface called Teamspeak and we shared some notes back and forth, the man knows his shit.

                  as far as him trying to outdesign Mazda, it's actually very very easy to out-design OEM specifications due to their alterior motives: price, durability, low-rpm power for everyday driving, smooth driveability, and gas mileage. someone like rob has one aim: maximum power output. with only one concern, it's really not hard to out-design OEM...you're not really out-designing, you're just re-designing for a new purpose. if you got the same mazda guys together with that single concern that rob has, I would bet they'd school him, even as much as he knows.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Winter.Raven
                    So does it make good HP? Hows install? Whats it look like? Does anyone have one? Problems? Is it workth 500 bucks?
                    prolly more like $750 with intrest and inflation

                    Lets see a dyno and then start talking about gains> your huge top end may be a 10lbft gain that feels HUGE against the 15lbft loss prior to 4000 rpms...
                    MazdaSPEED6

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Wonderboy
                      this MUST be a typo!
                      I was thinking the same thing. It's not a damn Escudo.

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                      • #26
                        slimmgt, keep in mind i have a ze...its not a typo....we tested it over and over. the slowest was a 3.3 with a stop watch. i know it isnt the most accurate....but still.

                        we got MOST of the idle problems fixed with a lot of RTV. over the next few days I will be making it perfect. pics up tonight.

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                        • #27
                          ummm....i forgot. someone made that "well mazda engineers.." blah.

                          snailman....you have a lot of mods on your car. thats kind of hypocritical isnt it?

                          as it stands, it is proven that LONGER runner produce MORE power on an NA engine. (shorter runners for a turbo engine) what it come down to, is that this IM has MORE air on longer runners being pumped into my engine. Equal air is being pumped into each cylinder. Its ugly as sin....but it does the job.

                          I need to replace my wires tomorrow and I will see how the dyno looks. (two wires are falling apart). Im guessing I will dyno it in a few days after my RTV cures completely.

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                          • #28
                            ^ I don't have "a lot" of mods, I have a ZE with modified intake (stock one won't work with a ZE anyhow), stronger clutch, and some poly bushings (stock ones were worn). There's a few things I'm omitting here, but "a lot" is probably not the best way to describe it.

                            Like I said, good luck, but you aren't going to convince me it's a good design, I can tell by looking at the pics that it's a piece of crap with little "design" put into it besides "make it fit."
                            '96 MX-6 LS V6 M/T KL-ZE / '93 MX-6 LS V6 A/T [R.I.P.]
                            '93 MX-6 LS V6 M/T KL-ZE [R.I.P.] / '94 Mazda 626 LS V6 M/T [R.I.P.]
                            http://www.cardomain.com/id/snailman153624

                            MY EMAIL ADDRESS IS NOT WORKING!

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                            • #29
                              wow.. fast car then !
                              2004 Dodge SRT-4
                              Mopar Stage 3 + bolt-ons - 400+ whp , Best 1/4 mile - 11.5 at 129 mph (1.97 60 ft)

                              1994 PGT KLZE
                              ,
                              Seli Cams, Megasquirt, 2.5 exhaust, hotshot headers, etc, etc, 190+WHP RIP

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Winter.Raven
                                as it stands, it is proven that LONGER runner produce MORE power on an NA engine.
                                you sure? why is every after market intake manifold made with short runners? why does mazda's VICS cross over from longer runners to incorporate short runner therory at high RPM? You're right, short runners are good for FI apps but also high RPM NA power too.
                                Matt Hicks
                                Silver 97 2.0 Turbo
                                Factory Green ZX6RR
                                If you have 1,000 posts and have not donated to PT, you should consider doing so.
                                "We're all still learning."

                                Comment

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