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  ProbeTalk.com Forums > General > Knowledge Base > Appearance Section

Appearance Section Talk about appearance modifications here.

 
March 4th, 2006, 06:25 AM   #1
probesport_gt
POC Mod
 
 
: Apr 2000
: Christiansburg, VA
: 39
: 17,525
Attention: Painters And Experienced Body People Needed!!!

Ok, just take a glance in the threads below and you are promised to find atleast one (if not more) threads on "How to I prep my car for paint", "how do I primer my car", "what grit paper needs to be used", "how much paint do I need", etc, etc etc.

I was hoping that together or someone could get a nice how-to written up that I could add to the FAQ. I know the work varies, but if would could atleast get a rough outline for people to get started that would be O SO GREAT!

So lets here some ideas about how to get this together!

Thanks in advance,
Wes
__________________
------------------------Wes Fenton------------------------
No longer a probe owner, but I'm still a probe enthusiast!
----------I can't believe I made it to 9 Myrtles!!!----------
 
March 5th, 2006, 12:31 AM   #2
AcidRayne
Guest
 
: Aug 2005
: 331
I'll get started on this tomarrow, should have it all written up by the end of the day.
 
March 10th, 2006, 07:47 AM   #3
DCA52387
Member
 
: Aug 2004
: Templeton, MA
: 32
: 183
If you need a hand let me know, I have a whole crap load of "ASE" and "I-Car" explanations I could break down into normal people terms
__________________
'88 Ford F-250 - 306, Ford Racing E-cam, Ported Heads, Port Matched intake, BBk Throttle Body, Jet Performance Chip.

'79 Ford Bronco - Custom 9" lift, 40" Ground Hawgs, Fully Built 466 w/ Edelbrock Performer Heads, Inatake, and 750cfm Carb Dynoing 515whp 563ft lbs, np205 /203 doubler transfercase, dana 60's front and rear, OX Cable locker up front, Spooled in the rear, custom tubular long travlel radius arms, full cage
 
March 10th, 2006, 09:03 PM   #4
ryanlavallee
PT Regular
 
: Jan 2005
: Winnipeg, Can
: 33
: 639
wash car before work and paint, before paint your going to need a speacial cleaner to remove all the dirt. (cant remember)

body work, if there is any, dont try to remove paint (less work later), putty, sand with everything up to 320, icing over that, sand icing with 320 on bad spots then 400. (all sanding should be done like the X way to ensure everything is equal.)On metal areas, your going to have to spray epoxy primer, this stuff expensive and needed only on open areas so it wont rust. Sand with 400 wet sandpaper, primer 3 coats, 400 wet sand, 3 coats of base (more layers can be added but 3 is good. Wet sand again, then clear. Clear hard b/c you cant wet sand, you need rubbing compound, and you have to buff out all the dust clumps in your clear. The better the station the less dust there will be in your clear and less work.

That's mostly paint, body work should be with hammers, and dollies, if the part is hard to work on remove it. If there was work done in the inside you need to spray the inside so it doesn't rust.

THere other stuff that you can add to your paint job that might have came stock, the best thing is you check out what your manufacture added, like some add chip guard, or other rust proof stuff.

Good Luck, the number one thing to do it take your time and the product will come out way better. Nothing takes a day!
__________________
92 GT RIP
93 GT SOLD
2000 Cougar
 
March 10th, 2006, 10:32 PM   #5
kazmir
Slow Learner
 
: Feb 2004
: Michigan
: 39
: 46
http://forums.probetalk.com/showthre...ighlight=paint
 
March 10th, 2006, 11:39 PM   #6
AcidRayne
Guest
 
: Aug 2005
: 331
That link to Syn's post is very nice, I have a pretty nice how-to also (I do TONS of custom work to probes, some pretty cool stuff, I'll prolly start putting some of them online soon) Just be aware that you should really practice painting on a junk car or on a junk part (an old hood is a good choice) before you try the real thing, airbrushes take a little bit of practice to get an even coat.
 
March 25th, 2006, 10:55 PM   #7
Eclipse
Turbo Member
 
: Apr 2000
: Osoyoos, BC, Canada
: 1,970
u need cleaner.. wax and grease remover.. we use dx440 and so on.. but thats ppg and it would diff based on the company..

i will explain a dent... theres two dents..
1. small door ding(example only) this dent is super easy to repair.. all u need to do is scuff the area.. 80 grit will do this fine.. go about 2 times the size of the dent.. don't worry if u go to big , u will just be blocking it down..
once scuffed apply filler, some ppl like to let it get hard but there is a happy medium where u can sand it with ease. this will take time to learn.
i should note that don't sand anything by hand that u can with a block..a side tip is to never sand with ur hand front to back. that will cause your fingures to dig in.. always go side to side.. so back on topic.. once it's getting dry take ur block with 80 and nail it down.. don't go crazy, but sand it down.. then reaply a nice thin coat of filler and sand in 180.. once again don't go crazy.. just get it down nice and flat.. now it's ready for primer ..(the second coat is for filling dents and the 80 grit scratch)

some ppl might say use an orbital..but anyone not in the trade.. and not with a year or more of using one i would say no..here is why.. body work will never be flat with an orbital.. and having a rookie who needs to read online how to do this makes it even worse. stick to hand tools.. takes more time but the finished product is so much better. even my boss thought he could do a better job then me with an orbital.. needless to say.. we repainted his door

dent number 2.. any thing bigger then this type of dent would requier metal shapping skills.
never just fill dents dings with mud . use a stud gun.. slid hammer, pick.. depending on where the dent is will show u what kind of tool to use. i think for this level of dent if u have no idea what i am talking about u shoudl not even attempt.. using a stud gun and holding it to long can cause the metal to heat and shrink. or u could pull it to far..both are very simple skills to learn but i would recomment having someone show u the first time. after u have fixed this type of dent, the same rules for dent one apply.


im going to assume thats the worst of ur repairs .. if not.. take it to a shop

Sand paper
24- 3000

the higher the number the smaller the grit.

there are two types of paper.. wet and dry. wet is more for primer and for doing cut polish.

finsih everything for primer in 180.. prime in a high build, use a nice guide coat like red or blue

finish the car in 400 dry and 800 wet and your ready for paint.


Always use wax remover before paint.. it's recommened to be used before primer to.. but most jobs we don't do that, it's over kill.


rule of thumb for blocks.. they should be bigger then area u are sanding.. so if the dent or spot is the size of hand the block should be bigger aka long board..

For best results with super flat finsih block your whole car front to back.. and reblock it once u have primed it..


primer..

epoxy and highbuild.. the two we use.. epoxy primer can be sprayed over bare metal. we use this mostly when have a major repair. we spray the repair before even doing body work just to make sure we get no rust. u can spray it anywhere u like .. but there really is no point.

always use a highbuild and lay 3 good coats and then a guidcoat..(guide coat is just any color paint, don't thin it.. don't add anything.. just the color unmixed) if u want a show quality job .. block sadn and reprime again.

sorry for grammer or spelling.. no spell check and no really no care to correct it ha
__________________
u should have died in that wreck. natural selection just isnt what it used to be...





shoot down a ufo.. they have a sweet drivetrain

: Automerged Doublepost
 
April 13th, 2006, 02:15 PM   #8
sweetdreams6983
Guest
 
: Apr 2006
: Texasss
: 8
Depending on how bad the original paint is you might have to go all the way down to 80 grit. We found an Integra for $250 and the clear coat and some of the paint was so bad off it was flaky and bubbly....a Maaco job finally expired. We had to get all the way down to original paint and get rid of all the different layers of crusted clear coat. Just watch lol that 80 grit for 2 days of sanding will eat through your fingers if you have virgin hands. After that is all done 180, then 220, then 320 should do you pretty well. Then get your cleaners n stuff and your ready for primer....depending on how many dings you have had to fill. I dont do the bondo thing....hubby does that...I just sand. Hope this helps a little.
 
April 13th, 2006, 03:05 PM   #9
CrimSon_ReD
Chasing the Boogey Man!
 
 
: Jun 2003
: Making Movies
: 55
: 20,396
I think I am just going to fly someone down here, let them stay at my lake house. Have them help me paint and prep my car and give them some cash when they leave... Being that I will pay for food and drinks, as well as the airline tickets I need to find someone good.

I have had a few good people with photos of their work respond to my ad on another site. I'm just hoping to find someone local since my paintjob wont be simple, and it will happen in a few stages from prepping, painting, airbrushing, clearcoating and wet sanding!
__________________
Artist, Writer, Photographer, Video Producer, Daddy!



 
April 13th, 2006, 09:31 PM   #10
sweetdreams6983
Guest
 
: Apr 2006
: Texasss
: 8
Thats a helluva deal right there lol..Too bad Im not an experienced painter yet lol...That'd be an awesome lil gettaway even if it was for work lol...
 
June 15th, 2006, 05:37 PM   #11
Ivanlucrazy
Member
 
: Jun 2004
: 214
:
u need cleaner.. wax and grease remover.. we use dx440 and so on.. but thats ppg and it would diff based on the company..

i will explain a dent... theres two dents..
1. small door ding(example only) this dent is super easy to repair.. all u need to do is scuff the area.. 80 grit will do this fine.. go about 2 times the size of the dent.. don't worry if u go to big , u will just be blocking it down..
once scuffed apply filler, some ppl like to let it get hard but there is a happy medium where u can sand it with ease. this will take time to learn.
i should note that don't sand anything by hand that u can with a block..a side tip is to never sand with ur hand front to back. that will cause your fingures to dig in.. always go side to side.. so back on topic.. once it's getting dry take ur block with 80 and nail it down.. don't go crazy, but sand it down.. then reaply a nice thin coat of filler and sand in 180.. once again don't go crazy.. just get it down nice and flat.. now it's ready for primer ..(the second coat is for filling dents and the 80 grit scratch)

some ppl might say use an orbital..but anyone not in the trade.. and not with a year or more of using one i would say no..here is why.. body work will never be flat with an orbital.. and having a rookie who needs to read online how to do this makes it even worse. stick to hand tools.. takes more time but the finished product is so much better. even my boss thought he could do a better job then me with an orbital.. needless to say.. we repainted his door

dent number 2.. any thing bigger then this type of dent would requier metal shapping skills.
never just fill dents dings with mud . use a stud gun.. slid hammer, pick.. depending on where the dent is will show u what kind of tool to use. i think for this level of dent if u have no idea what i am talking about u shoudl not even attempt.. using a stud gun and holding it to long can cause the metal to heat and shrink. or u could pull it to far..both are very simple skills to learn but i would recomment having someone show u the first time. after u have fixed this type of dent, the same rules for dent one apply.


im going to assume thats the worst of ur repairs .. if not.. take it to a shop

Sand paper
24- 3000

the higher the number the smaller the grit.

there are two types of paper.. wet and dry. wet is more for primer and for doing cut polish.

finsih everything for primer in 180.. prime in a high build, use a nice guide coat like red or blue

finish the car in 400 dry and 800 wet and your ready for paint.


Always use wax remover before paint.. it's recommened to be used before primer to.. but most jobs we don't do that, it's over kill.


rule of thumb for blocks.. they should be bigger then area u are sanding.. so if the dent or spot is the size of hand the block should be bigger aka long board..

For best results with super flat finsih block your whole car front to back.. and reblock it once u have primed it..


primer..

epoxy and highbuild.. the two we use.. epoxy primer can be sprayed over bare metal. we use this mostly when have a major repair. we spray the repair before even doing body work just to make sure we get no rust. u can spray it anywhere u like .. but there really is no point.

always use a highbuild and lay 3 good coats and then a guidcoat..(guide coat is just any color paint, don't thin it.. don't add anything.. just the color unmixed) if u want a show quality job .. block sadn and reprime again.

sorry for grammer or spelling.. no spell check and no really no care to correct it ha

This man speaks the truth, however I would recommend using 180 then 220 on areas where you sanded with 80 grit. That way, when you go to spray 2k primer etc. there is much less chance of anything showing up in the final paint job.

Also, if your car is black, or pretty much any other really dark color, take it to a shop if you care about visible imperfections and/or scratches etc. because it's one of those colors where you can see everything. Especially when buffing, swirl marks are easily visible.
 
July 21st, 2006, 07:52 PM   #12
strongdynamics
Newbie
 
: Nov 2001
: Kansas City
: 7
StrongDynamics

Everyone so far has given somewhat decent ideas as to proceedures needed for a decent paint job. However most I have seen deveate here and there which may cause more problems than help. I am a custom painter and body fabrications specialist and the I could right some huge time consuming bit here but I think you need to keep it simple. The best advise I can give you is to go to your local library and pick up a Chiltons or Haynes Manual on Auto Body Repair and or Custom Paint. They will have a step by step proceedure and pictures to explain it better than anyone could through a short thread.

One major trick to use that you won't find in any book is to use a refinishers degreaser (eg. "PPG Final Prep" or equivilant) and spray on a layer over your finished body work. It will simulate 2 to 3 coats of clear coat. If your bodywork looks like crap or if it is still wavey or if you still see your sanding scratches, wipe off the degreaser and keep sanding.

Best of luck.
 
July 21st, 2006, 11:54 PM   #13
desertfox1313
Five Star Member
 
 
: Mar 2002
: SOCAL
: 35
: 3,805
i think that this is just like fiberglass... go get some good quality paint of a cheap color, a medium quality spraygun... and just go for it (for painting) the basics are easy to understand..but in practice... you have to learn when the paint is about to sag or run... how to spray enough on that you get a good smooth coat... but dont do too much.
After awhile you can spray a clearcoat without even having to sand on your final coat and it will be a near mirror finish. For me its just lots of practice, and i can do a small piece perfectly, a large piece well, and a wierd contured piece (front bumper) just ok. I am learning with rio red ( 100 dollars for a quart of color and clear) with black, white you can get as low as 50 for moderate quality paints, and then you just practice till you get it.

As i learn more I can post a basic... how to learn to paint but as im still mid process learning i wont spend too much time till i can say x vs y with confidence.

Biggest thing i have learned... once you think your surface is perfect... go over it 2 more times. A perfectly prepped surface makes the difference, paint quality, skill and the spraygun are secondary to how nice the surface is haha.
__________________
Got boost?
2003 Mazdaspeed Protege #695
Few tweaks but effectively stock. Going over two weeks without repairs... so amazing

.
 
February 21st, 2007, 09:45 PM   #14
knightraven93
Guest
 
: Jan 2007
: Kelowna BC
: 39
:
i think that this is just like fiberglass... go get some good quality paint of a cheap color, a medium quality spraygun... and just go for it (for painting) the basics are easy to understand..but in practice... you have to learn when the paint is about to sag or run... how to spray enough on that you get a good smooth coat... but dont do too much.
After awhile you can spray a clearcoat without even having to sand on your final coat and it will be a near mirror finish. For me its just lots of practice, and i can do a small piece perfectly, a large piece well, and a wierd contured piece (front bumper) just ok. I am learning with rio red ( 100 dollars for a quart of color and clear) with black, white you can get as low as 50 for moderate quality paints, and then you just practice till you get it.

As i learn more I can post a basic... how to learn to paint but as im still mid process learning i wont spend too much time till i can say x vs y with confidence.

Biggest thing i have learned... once you think your surface is perfect... go over it 2 more times. A perfectly prepped surface makes the difference, paint quality, skill and the spraygun are secondary to how nice the surface is haha.

So true, Learning to paint is all about pratice. Doing it the same way and speed every time.

And a little tip on surface prep, when i paint in the shop for primer and primer surfacers. I clean the surface 5 times twice with DX440, twice with air and a cleaning pad and the last with a tack cloth and air.

When it comes to BC/CC I clean the surface 7 times and tack cloth between each coat(no air)... I was always told there is no such thing as cleaning too much.
 
February 22nd, 2007, 02:29 PM   #15
desertfox1313
Five Star Member
 
 
: Mar 2002
: SOCAL
: 35
: 3,805
Another trick I learned from a guy near me, was to use a silicon additive to prevent fish eye, that way if you miss that LIL spot while cleaning, you wont get hosed.
__________________
Got boost?
2003 Mazdaspeed Protege #695
Few tweaks but effectively stock. Going over two weeks without repairs... so amazing

.
 
February 22nd, 2007, 05:41 PM   #16
ZEturboGT1
aka:
SilverPGT-R
White94GTS
 
: May 2006
: Central Ohio
: 1,630
its called fisheye eliminator!
 
April 19th, 2007, 10:51 PM   #17
Eclipse
Turbo Member
 
: Apr 2000
: Osoyoos, BC, Canada
: 1,970
but fisheye eliminator is not as good as it sounds and could screw with paint.. just a warning
__________________
u should have died in that wreck. natural selection just isnt what it used to be...





shoot down a ufo.. they have a sweet drivetrain
 
April 20th, 2007, 09:54 AM   #18
desertfox1313
Five Star Member
 
 
: Mar 2002
: SOCAL
: 35
: 3,805
dont use too much, I have used it everytime and have never seen any problems
__________________
Got boost?
2003 Mazdaspeed Protege #695
Few tweaks but effectively stock. Going over two weeks without repairs... so amazing

.
 
April 20th, 2007, 10:40 PM   #19
knightraven93
Guest
 
: Jan 2007
: Kelowna BC
: 39
another trick is to dry spray the fish eyes, and do an extra coat. Saves having to go buy extra product.

fisheye eliminator dose work but effects the quility of the paint.

Ive never had to use it yet... knock on wood! But that is probally cause i clean the car 7 times before paint and tack cloth between coats.
 
May 16th, 2007, 04:01 PM   #20
Phat '93PGT
Five Star Member
 
 
: Jul 2000
: Chillicothe, OH
: 37
: 3,908
this is some good stuff.
anyone have any words about chipped paint?
like if the tip of a fender is bent in at a 90 degree angle and the paint has cracked off it?

how would you "feather?" it to blend with new paint, or would you have to repaint the whole fender?
__________________
96 PGT
Gettin' there.....slowly


 
May 16th, 2007, 04:19 PM   #21
desertfox1313
Five Star Member
 
 
: Mar 2002
: SOCAL
: 35
: 3,805
well, if you can reform it s it looks good, then i would sand the whole fender down and just start over. But for the price of a fender at a junkyard its probably not worth your time.
__________________
Got boost?
2003 Mazdaspeed Protege #695
Few tweaks but effectively stock. Going over two weeks without repairs... so amazing

.
 
May 16th, 2007, 04:49 PM   #22
Phat '93PGT
Five Star Member
 
 
: Jul 2000
: Chillicothe, OH
: 37
: 3,908
i straightened the fender out. just didn't know if i can "touch up" the corner or not.
took me forever to find a good black fender.
lol
__________________
96 PGT
Gettin' there.....slowly


 
July 1st, 2007, 10:37 AM   #23
breezn
Search Impaired
 
: May 2007
: 69
Just prime the spot where the chip was, after you smooth it out. Scuff the whole fender, and paint JUst where the primer is. After the primer is covered, go out around the whole are 2-4 inches and blend in the paint si its not noticable. You DON NOT have to PAINT teh whole fender. after that CLEAR the whole fender, let dry, wet sand, buff, beautiful!!
 
July 7th, 2007, 02:05 PM   #24
Phat '93PGT
Five Star Member
 
 
: Jul 2000
: Chillicothe, OH
: 37
: 3,908
ok, now what about paint chipped off a bumper?
the bottom of my bumper has paint chipped off. im gonna be primering the car within the next couple days.

im using Eclipse writeup about filling the door dings.

another question, before i primer the whole car, what should i sand the car in?
__________________
96 PGT
Gettin' there.....slowly


 
July 25th, 2007, 08:12 AM   #25
CrimSon_ReD
Chasing the Boogey Man!
 
 
: Jun 2003
: Making Movies
: 55
: 20,396
I am purchasing my paint today, how much paint is required to paint a probe?
__________________
Artist, Writer, Photographer, Video Producer, Daddy!



 

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