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The big MegaSquirt guide for 2nd gen Probe GTs

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  • The big MegaSquirt guide for 2nd gen Probe GTs

    We've put together a complete MegaSquirt guide to the 2nd generation Probe GT. You can access the most up to date, unabridged version here:

    How to MegaSquirt your 2nd gen Probe GT

    Here's what you need to run MS2/Extra on your Probe with the stock distributor. The link above also includes notes on MS1/Extra, coil packs, the differences in wiring between an MX-6 and a Probe, and more.

    Application(s): This article covers the 1993-1997 Ford Probe GT, Mazda MX-6, and Mazda 626 equipped with the KL-DE, KL-03, or KL-ZE engines (2.5 liter V6), with a manual tranmsission. See notes about automatic transmissions under "Other Things the ECU Controls." The first generation Probe LX used a 3.0 pushrod V6 with electronics very similar to the 5.0 Mustang, and can be MegaSquirted using the same mods as in our Mustang article.

    Level of control: Full Standalone EMS-- Fuel and Ignition Control

    There have been several ways to install MegaSquirt on these engines, but we've worked out a method of using the stock crank trigger wheel and the one tooth wheel in the distributor to get the accuracy of a crank trigger, without having to file any teeth off the pulley or make any other changes to the engine wiring. This works on both OBD-I and OBD-II motors, so if you have a later car, there's no need to swap in an early distributor.

    Using the MS-II PCBv3 or V3.57 ECU

    with MS2/Extra 2.0.1 or later code

    * Build the ECU up to trigger from the VR Input. Jumper TachSelect to VRIN and TSEL to VROUT.
    * We will need a 5 volt pull up on the ignition input.
    * For a V3.0 board, run a 270 ohm resistor from the 5 volt source in the proto area or the right side of R24 to the top (negative) lead of D14, and run a jumper wire from the negative lead of D14 to IGN.
    * For a V3.57 board, run a jumper from PAD1 to the center hole of the Q16 slot, remove Q16 if fitted, and run a 330 ohm resistor from PAD4 to PAD1.
    * We'll also need a second trigger input. Solder a 1K resistor onto a length of wire, and cover the resistor with heat shrink tubing. Connect this resistor-on-a-wire combination from JS10 to SPR1 (for a V3.0 board) or PAD7 (for a V3.57 board).
    * Solder a 470 ohm resistor onto a length of wire and cover with heat shrink tubing. Run this resistor-on-a-wire from the 5 volt terminal in the proto area to the same input pin (SPR1 or PAD7) used in the previous step.
    * Connect a 0.1 uF capacitor from JS10 to SG or the proto area ground.

    The wiring color chart is not easy to post on this forum, but it's available in the article.

    Idle Air Control

    These engines use a pulse width modulated (PWM) idle air control motor. A V3.57 board can control this directly. With a V3.0 board, you will need to add our PWM idle control mod kit to control this valve.
    Other Things the ECU Controls

    The stock ECU controls a couple other devices in these cars besides the injectors, ignition, and IAC valve. Here's what to do about the ones you will need to control.

    Fuel pump: This is a standard output on the Megasquirt. Wire the Megasquirt pin 37 to the fuel pump relay wire that went to the stock ECU.

    Air conditioning: While the stock ECU controls the air conditioner, you don't need a computer to make this work. Wiring the A/C request wire running to the ECU to the A/C compressor relay should make this work, although we have not tested this one for ourselves.

    VRIS: The Variable Resonance Induction System uses two separate solenoids to operate a set of butterflies in the intake manifold to change the intake characteristics. You can leave both open, but it is possible to control them with the MegaSquirt. The factory settings have VRIS valve 1 open at 3250 RPM and valve 2 open at 4250 RPM. You can drive the solenoids from the MegaSquirt using our relay control mod kits.

    Cooling fans: There are two relays for the cooling fans in these cars, one of which turns on the fan in low speed mode and the other turns on the fan in high speed mode. You can either maintain the two stage mode by using one output to turn the low speed fan on and a second output to turn on the high speed fan at a higher temperature, or simply run the fan off at low temperatures and at high speed when the engine gets hot. Use our relay control mod kits for fan control.

    For more information about the relay outputs, see our Common MegaSquirt Modifications page. Note that the MS1 has only four such outputs, and using them all will keep you from being able to also run boost control. With the MS2, there are enough general purpose outputs to run all four VRIS and fan outputs and have one left over.

    Automatic transmission: On OBD-II cars, this is controlled by the ECU directly, so if you have a '96 or later car with an automatic, you'll need to do a parallel installation. (See this link for more information on how to do this.) On '95 and earlier cars, the transmission ahs a separate controller and it looks like this can work without the stock ECU, although we have not confirmed that at this point.

    Gauges: These are not controlled by the ECU, so if you're using the stock distributor you have nothing to worry about here.

    MegaTune Configuration for MS2/Extra

    Set the following under Tach Input / Ignition Settings.

    * Spark mode: Toothed Wheel
    * Trigger Angle / Offset: 0
    * Ignition Input Capture: Rising Edge
    * Spark Output: Going Low / Normal It is critical to get the Spark Output Inverted setting correct, as setting this wrong can result in damage to the ignition module or coil.
    * Number of coils: Single Coil
    * Spark A output pin: D14

    Dwell settings will depend on the coil used; 2.5 to 3.0 msec is a safe starting point. A typical rule of thumb is to back off the dwell until you can just barely detect a misfire under lean cruising conditions, then add 0.2 ms of dwell time.

    Use these trigger wheel settings.

    * Trigger wheel arrangement: Dual Wheel
    * Trigger wheel teeth: 6
    * Missing teeth: 0
    * Tooth #1 Angle: 60 (this may need to be adjusted slightly due to production tolerances)
    * Wheel speed: Crank Wheel
    * Second trigger active on: Rising and Falling
    * and every rotation of: Crank

    If you use someone else's .msq file we do recommend you check the firmware version the .msq file was built on as you cannot always use a file built on one firmware version with an ECU running a different version or a different ignition setup-- it's best to use the .msq files with the same version of the firmware that the file was built on. Alternately you can manually copy the settings over from the borrowed file.

    We can build MegaSquirts with the mods listed in the article if you're interested - email us at websales@diyautotune.com to go over your options and get a complete quote.
    Matt at DIYAutoTune.com
    My PM box fills up fast - it's much better to email me at websales@diyautotune.com

  • #2
    thanks for taking the time to put together a how to for your site, im sure it will be very helpful to ms newbies

    its actually a bit surreal...when i first signed up for pt i wouldve never dreamed i would see instructions for standalone engine management on a vendor site...but there it is! diyautotune FTW!
    Last edited by 94PGT; June 10, 2009, 10:34 AM.
    Black 94 PGT - squirted, LSD'd, turbo DE/ZE hybrid @ 8psi

    Forget the dog...turbos are a man's best friend

    Comment


    • #3
      You're welcome. We've seen a lot of Probe owners running our products and want to do our part to support them. I campaigned a Probe for a season in the Atlanta autocross events before I joined DIYAutoTune myself.
      Last edited by Matt Cramer; June 10, 2009, 10:54 AM.
      Matt at DIYAutoTune.com
      My PM box fills up fast - it's much better to email me at websales@diyautotune.com

      Comment


      • #4
        Nice writeup Matt! I didn't read through the whole thing, but it looks pretty good. I'm going to sticky this.
        I believe in moderation and that includes moderation.
        92 Lexus SC300 - 780whp/700tq 36+ psi

        Comment


        • #5


          It's now linked from my POC's site/forum. Thanks!
          BC Probe Owners Club is VERY MUCH ALIVE - www.bcpoc.ca
          93 PGT 2.5L SILVER - Stock DE, ZE Intake Manifold, T3/T4 .50/.63 AR Turbo, Valant Turbo Pipes, Tial 38mm Wastegate (~9PSI), Custom Water/Meth Injection, Megasquirt v3 (MSnS-Extra 029q2 Fuel/Spark), Millennia Injectors @ 70psi, 65mm TB, JJ Resonated TP, Centerforce DF Clutch, MX3 Flywheel, AWR Mounts, it begins all over again...
          93 PGT 2.5L BLACK Dismantled
          GARAGE - The hybrid with a piston hole... lots of various leftovers...

          Comment


          • #6
            Thank you for sticking this thread. One thing I'd like to add is that our write up may have somewhat different mods from other how-to guides. This doesn't mean there is anything wrong with the other guides as there are several possible ways to put MegaSquirt on these cars. I happened to pick this method because it works on all years with the KLDE and doesn't need any mods to existing sensors.
            Matt at DIYAutoTune.com
            My PM box fills up fast - it's much better to email me at websales@diyautotune.com

            Comment


            • #7
              I went through the set up and when ever I use toothed wheel I get cranking rpms for few secs and then they are gone, but when I put it to basic trigger I get rpms but still no start, I will look more into it in the morning.

              BTW Im running MSD with 4 pin HEI, it shouldnt matter because stock ecu ran it fine.
              93 PGT Kitted and all -sold,
              Current 93 PGT-ZE-T So far: 12" brakes, ZE, T3/T4 turbo, 2.5" exhaust , ACT 6-puck, MSD6AL+2step, Coilovers, 245/45/17x9 cobra r, 67mm TB, MS II, traction bars, meth inj. and more.
              1980 Corvette Vortec 350 and side pipes

              OBJECTS IN THE MIRROR ARE LOSING

              Comment


              • #8
                You may just need to adjust the VR trim pots a bit. You might want to mod it for direct coil control output and have it drive the MSD box directly; a MegaSquirt plus a HEI module plus an MSD box is a bit more electronics than you need. But that can (and should) wait until you get the RPM fixed.
                Last edited by Matt Cramer; July 6, 2009, 11:15 AM.
                Matt at DIYAutoTune.com
                My PM box fills up fast - it's much better to email me at websales@diyautotune.com

                Comment


                • #9
                  Me and my friend were talking about it, my MS is set up for direct coil and I believe HEI is freaking out about it. I gonna splice into the wires for ign signal to ms and will have car run on stock ECU and will see if I can get RPM signal, once I get it I should be golden, and will get rid of HEI

                  EDIT
                  I wired in straight to the MSD box, and if I set to basic trigger I can start the car but it wont Idle below 1.5k rpms and AFR are 10-10.2 ign advance is at 36*.
                  Using dual trigger I managed to start once, but most of the time I would get rpm signal for a sec and loose it, turning resistors doesn't seem to help.


                  Can I trigger of disty only, if so do I need to remove the mods from DIY page
                  Using the MS-II PCBv3 or V3.57 ECU

                  with MS2/Extra 2.0.1 or later code

                  * Build the ECU up to trigger from the VR Input. Jumper TachSelect to VRIN and TSEL to VROUT.
                  * We will need a 5 volt pull up on the ignition input.
                  o For a V3.0 board, run a 270 ohm resistor from the 5 volt source in the proto area or the right side of R24 to the top (negative) lead of D14, and run a jumper wire from the negative lead of D14 to IGN.
                  o For a V3.57 board, run a jumper from PAD1 to the center hole of the Q16 slot, remove Q16 if fitted, and run a 330 ohm resistor from PAD4 to PAD1.
                  * We'll also need a second trigger input. Solder a 1K resistor onto a length of wire, and cover the resistor with heat shrink tubing. Connect this resistor-on-a-wire combination from JS10 to SPR1 (for a V3.0 board) or PAD7 (for a V3.57 board).
                  * Solder a 470 ohm resistor onto a length of wire and cover with heat shrink tubing. Run this resistor-on-a-wire from the 5 volt terminal in the proto area to the same input pin (SPR1 or PAD7) used in the previous step.
                  * Connect a 0.1 uF capacitor from JS10 to SG or the proto area ground.
                  Are you sure you used G signal and not NE1 signal for Cam sensor? because I talked to other member with ms 2.2 and he is using NE1 for cam sensor
                  http://www.pazzer.net/pazzer/served/...2.5GT/C246.GIF
                  Last edited by artsvetkov; July 6, 2009, 10:51 PM.
                  93 PGT Kitted and all -sold,
                  Current 93 PGT-ZE-T So far: 12" brakes, ZE, T3/T4 turbo, 2.5" exhaust , ACT 6-puck, MSD6AL+2step, Coilovers, 245/45/17x9 cobra r, 67mm TB, MS II, traction bars, meth inj. and more.
                  1980 Corvette Vortec 350 and side pipes

                  OBJECTS IN THE MIRROR ARE LOSING

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    There are several possible ways to wire up the MegaSquirt, and different wiring works with different settings. How is yours set up? Our wiring method should not even run (or if it does, you'll get twice the RPM and your timing will be WAY off) if set to Basic Trigger if you have used both our mods and our wiring.
                    Last edited by Matt Cramer; July 7, 2009, 07:20 AM.
                    Matt at DIYAutoTune.com
                    My PM box fills up fast - it's much better to email me at websales@diyautotune.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yeah I was using your method and I would get stable cracking rpm only in basic trigger, but when it runs the timing is way off.
                      93 PGT Kitted and all -sold,
                      Current 93 PGT-ZE-T So far: 12" brakes, ZE, T3/T4 turbo, 2.5" exhaust , ACT 6-puck, MSD6AL+2step, Coilovers, 245/45/17x9 cobra r, 67mm TB, MS II, traction bars, meth inj. and more.
                      1980 Corvette Vortec 350 and side pipes

                      OBJECTS IN THE MIRROR ARE LOSING

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Adjust the timing using the "trigger offset" function of MS2, then run through a wide range of RPM's and see if the timing is what the MS says. If so, then run the basic trigger. As long as the timing is consistent throughout the RPM range you don't really have anything to worry about.

                        00 Saturn SL2, boosting @ 15-20 psi
                        Gimme an SRT4 for breakfast! Boosting plastic appliances is fun.
                        Engine: fully forged, 8.5:1 CR, p&p, balanced to 9k, T3/T4 .63 turbine, FSR cams, meth-injected..
                        "There is a replacement for displacement, and it's shaped like a snail"

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Basic Trigger mode assumes you are getting one pulse from the distributor per spark. There are mods you can use on some, but not all, KLDE motors to use basic trigger mode. Basic trigger mode does not work when using the stock crank trigger because it gives you two pulses per spark instead of one.
                          Matt at DIYAutoTune.com
                          My PM box fills up fast - it's much better to email me at websales@diyautotune.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I've tried to reach you through your emal from your website but haven't gotten any thing back.

                            For 2.0L (same engine in PROBE SE and MSP)

                            How can I set it up to control 2 coil packs ?

                            I need to do only 50b ?

                            On 62 to continue with PWM idle valve installation I should not install Q4,Q20,D8,R39 ?
                            I plan to let STOCK ECU to control idle in winter and MSII in summer.

                            Do you have a HOw-to install boost-modkit ?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Speed3.5 View Post
                              I've tried to reach you through your emal from your website but haven't gotten any thing back.

                              For 2.0L (same engine in PROBE SE and MSP)

                              How can I set it up to control 2 coil packs ?
                              You will need a 36-1 crank trigger. Depending on your year, you may already have one. We have an article on 36-1 crank triggers here:

                              http://www.diyautotune.com/tech_arti...eels_index.htm

                              I need to do only 50b ?
                              Step 50B is only used if the MS is not controlling the ignition at all.

                              On 62 to continue with PWM idle valve installation I should not install Q4,Q20,D8,R39 ?
                              I plan to let STOCK ECU to control idle in winter and MSII in summer.
                              These components are not used with a PWM IAC valve. MS2/Extra's closed loop idle has come along well enough that you may want to let the MS2 control it full time.

                              Do you have a HOw-to install boost-modkit ?
                              This is the closest thing right now:

                              http://www.msextra.com/ms2extra/MS2-...ware.htm#boost

                              We've found the diode is not needed though.
                              Matt at DIYAutoTune.com
                              My PM box fills up fast - it's much better to email me at websales@diyautotune.com

                              Comment

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