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-   -   Overcharging Alternator - car shutdown (https://forums.probetalk.com/showthread.php?t=1701318144)

shdtree95 January 14th, 2016 06:00 PM

Overcharging Alternator - car shutdown
 
Car is 95 Probe GT and I drove the car too long with overcharging alternator and it cooked the battery dry. Just before the car shutdown, the voltage gauge pegged to the top and the dash lights flashed, and then the car stalled.
I replaced battery and the car cranks, no spark, headlights come on, not sure if dash lights come on. I know I need to replace the alternator, possibly distributor but what do you think the condition of the PCM or ECU may be? Still need to check to see if fuel pump kicks on because I don't hear it when I turn the key on. Also, no check engine light when I turn the key on. I do see the symbol that looks like a driver behind a steering wheel, the same one that lit when the alternator started to overcharge. I have driven this car 10 years and have never noticed that one.

Thanks

silversensi January 14th, 2016 06:10 PM

There are endless possibilities as what could have been damaged by this. But with out actually doing circuit testing I can't tell you what is wrong. I hope you have some good diagnosis skills, good luck. And it can be fixed just be patient with it. These cars are becoming very rare now and it would be a shame to see another go to the jy

shdtree95 January 15th, 2016 04:34 AM

Overcharging Alternator -
 
Yes I agree with you. I am not ready to let this car go and it will sit through the winter until I can get into it in a couple of months. Thanks for the response.

yellowrob January 15th, 2016 08:39 PM

Check the "main fuse" under the hood, it's the only 100 amp one. ITS BOLTED IN, don't just pull it.

dukes193 January 15th, 2016 08:51 PM

^^^ that was my thought as well

stoker100 January 16th, 2016 04:40 PM

my alternators internal regulator failed once and overcharged (to 17+V) i remember driving home with the fan on full blast, rear demister on, headlights on etc and if i went above 2000rpm or the ECU would shut off. time to swap out your alternator. they do fail often, im on my third one.

Pieterprobe January 16th, 2016 10:54 PM

interesting.. the exact and i mean exact same thing happened to me while i was driving my spare probe. i have not had any time to look at the car but the roadside assistance guy told me my alternator fried the ignition, the car currently runs if you hotwire it and jump the starter.:darin:

shdtree95 March 24th, 2017 05:29 PM

Update to overcharged battery
 
Had the ECU repaired by a company in CO, do not recall the name, but I now have a check engine light when the key is turned on, I replaced distributor and I have spark, I have fuel at the fuel rail yet I do not hear the pump running with key turned on. Car tries to start, but doesn't. Also, if it cranks for more than 3 seconds, it seems to jump or buck or get out of its smooth cranking sequence. I have verified my timing with No 1 piston approaching TDC and rotor pointing to No 1 terminal on distributor cap. This is where I am at. I am starting to thing the engine jumped crank and cam timing?

93lazerpgt March 24th, 2017 06:00 PM

Not sure how you could have jumped crank cam timing with the original problem. Do you have pressure at the rail or did it just trickle our?

BLUEnoEQ March 24th, 2017 07:31 PM

Mine made similar sounds when the rear cam wheel pin got mashed. It looked like everything was in time but wasn't turning the rear cams. Take off the intake, rear cam cover and turn the engine by hand (crank pulley only so you don't ruin possibly good timing,) if the cams don't move that's the problem. Mine stumbled occasionally, cranked forever, had fuel. Also check the button in the distributor cap, I've had one of those break off before while checking everything. Finally check the fuel pump fuse anything could have blown and see if the fuel shut cutoff needs to be reset in the trunk. Sounds like it has fuel if it stumbles here and there though. Check all the sensors you can and the distributor with a multimeter. That's my list of off the wall stuff to check.

shdtree95 March 28th, 2017 05:52 PM

93laserpgt
 
The fuel at the rail is just a trickle. The pump is clearly not humming, I have a signal at the fuel pump relay, but I need to check the inertia switch and may need to install a fuel pump.

93lazerpgt March 29th, 2017 10:19 AM

Sounds like your on the right track

shdtree95 March 29th, 2017 05:22 PM

Thanks
 
Yes a good challenge to get this car back on the road -

shdtree95 April 9th, 2017 03:57 PM

Update
 
I bypassed the inertia switch and I now have steady fuel coming from the pump, however, have not yet tested fuel pressure rating. The car starts, upon starting, seems to run for maybe a second and then dies. I can smell the combustion coming from back of car. I am now guessing the ignition switch took a hit from the battery overcharge or else the exhaust is clogged from sitting for 1 1/2 years now. Need to do further testing.

shdtree95 June 18th, 2017 01:35 PM

Updated on overcharged battery
 
1)Okay - the car will run for 5 seconds when fuel is introduced into intake manifold through pcv port. Normal cranking the car sounds like it will start, but stumbles before turning over. I can smell some combustion at the tail pipe.

2)I bypassed the fuel inertia switch to eliminate that as a point of failure.

3)i replaced the fuel pump relay and when I remove it, I get a signal with the test light on the 2 contacts closest to the firewall.

4)When I jump the two terminals closest to drivers fender with pump relay removed, I DO NOT hear the fuel pump but I hear a slight hum in the fuel rail and fuel is clearly being introduced into fuel rail.

5)When I removed the fuel pressure regulator and jump those 2 terminals in the previous step, I get lots of fuel exiting the fuel rail.

6)When I jump the FP and GRND in the diagnostic box, the fuel pump makes no noise.

7)I have the rear seat removed and was ready to cut an access hole to remove and replace pump, but it is working to some degree. Could it be working but only providing a flow of fuel which is less pressure than required to run?

8)Could it be the Fuel Pressure Regulator causing this condition?

Thanks for your input.

branscoset June 18th, 2017 06:08 PM

I would test fuel pressure before replacing the pump. I would also suggest dropping the tank, its not that hard. If you want to cut a hole though, I guess its your car after all lol.

shdtree95 June 19th, 2017 10:51 AM

Fuel pressure test
 
I had some clear thought in the morning and will test the fuel pressure. The bolts holding the straps are heavily rusted, and if they snap off, then I have more work ahead of me.

Thanks,

J_Unit June 19th, 2017 03:24 PM

Have you tried changing the timing some? I had the same issue with my car starting and running for one second then dying after I repaired the wire harness and slammed a new disty in it. I was at a loss cuz I just did so much work and was just like wtf could be wrong now. Turned the disty counter clockwise about a half inch and she fired right up and stayed running. Give it a try. The car gods have to give us probe owners a break every once in awhile.

shdtree95 June 19th, 2017 04:19 PM

J Unit
 
I will give that a shot. The original distributor fried from the overcharge and I replaced it and now have good spark. I dialed it in so that the engine cranks the smoothest. May need to adjust more.

shdtree95 June 24th, 2017 10:33 AM

Fuel Pressure Testing
 
Ok - Ford shop manual states 38-46 psi with key on and engine off - my fuel pressure gauge reads 0 as the pump does not spin up.

When cranking the engine, it steadily climbs to about 40 psi, but it seems not enough to start the engine. I think I need in the neighborhood of 52 psi to start the engine.

Any thoughts?

stoker100 June 24th, 2017 04:04 PM

38psi is enough. When cranking it should go to 40psi prety quickly, how long dies it take to climb?

shdtree95 June 25th, 2017 06:10 AM

Fuel Pressure Testing
 
When I had an assistant read the gauge when cranking, it only made it to 22 psi max. When I jumped the FP and GND in the diagnostic box, fuel pressure only registered 11 psi. I am just about convinced I need to replace the fuel pump considering that it very well experienced a voltage surge from the overcharged battery issue that originally caused the issues I am seeing.

Thanks,

stoker100 June 25th, 2017 02:14 PM

Yeah swap that pump over.

shdtree95 August 8th, 2017 05:00 PM

Clocking the New Distributor
 
Ok - have a new fuel pump installed and it primes and is pumping fuel into the motor. But car only cranks and did not fire. Found TDC on No. 1 piston and saw that the distributor rotor is pointing to 12 o'clock instead of 6 o'clock where the No. 1 plug terminal is on the cap. So I remove distributor, rotate the rotor 180 degrees, but distributor will not fully seat back into the block. So I refer to my shop manual and it states that "one of the tangs on the shaft is larger than the other and this allows the distributor to be installed in only one position". Does this mean I remove the rotor and clock that to the correct position pointing at No. 1 plug terminal? I am sure I am at TDC on compression stroke on No. 1 cylinder by bumping over the motor with a remote starter, small ball of newspaper pops out of No. 1 hole, then I insert a length of vacuum line in so it hits the piston and I manually turn the motor over until the vacuum line stops rising out of the hole. I have a one-piece aluminum crank pulley and do not see a timing mark. Long story short, i believe I am 180 degrees out on my distributor timing which is keeping the car from starting.

Thanks

BLUEnoEQ August 8th, 2017 09:59 PM

I think you are confusing TDC on the exhaust stroke with TDC on the compression stroke. The piston goes up and down twice before firing again so when it is at TDC exhaust the distributor would be 180* out. Turn the crank over 1 more time to TDC and the disty should be at 1. 2 turns of the crank is one full cycle of the cams/distributor.

I don't know if you have timing belt covers on or not but if you can see the rear pulley, see if the head of the bolt spins with the pulley while you turn the crank by hand (21 mm socket). If not then the pulley only looks like it's turning the rear bank and everything will appear in time and functioning. You've got fuel, should have spark, the parts only really go on 1 way. It's weird though because it ran before.


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