Report: Arospeed coilovers on 97 PGT

[Probe 2C]

Originally posted by PSE driver


Rayman. A buddy of mine just ordered these for his Base. the spring rates were listed on the side of the spring with the fronts being 450 and the rears being 350.

That was posted before I believe, but that is incredibly high. If that were true I could see why the ride would be so intolerable.

Also of note skelly, Illuminas (so I'm told) are not as large in circumference as KYB's or Blues. Thus if you were to utilize Illuminas you would probably not have the requirement of modifying your strut (other than the perch).

Reading this is quite scary for me as I have GC's & Illuminas on order. Ray & I went with lower rates for a more comfortable ride (I'm happy to set mine higher & have a more comfy ride).

[Rayman]

Originally posted by Probe 2C

Reading this is quite scary for me as I have GC's & Illuminas on order. Ray & I went with lower rates for a more comfortable ride (I'm happy to set mine higher & have a more comfy ride).

while i will only have tokico blues, so mine will be like 3-4 on the illuminas all the time the rates me and chris both got are 325 fronts and 225 rears

[skelly]

Part III: Day 4 - Revelations

Well on my lunch break today, whilst peering in the midday sun through the crack between the fender and the tire trying to get a view of the coilover assembly, I was shocked when suddenly became visible the fact that I was not just hitting the bump stops.. i was riding ON them full time! No damn wonder.

So, later I performed some surgery:

1) Front bearings re-installed (thanks Derek, this was a life-saver!)

2) Trimmed another 1/4 inch off the bottom of the front bump stops (this leaves approximately 1/2 of the original top (thickest) and the full middle segments)

3) raised the coils by 3/8 of an inch on all 4 corners.

The result: a barely noticable increase in ride height, about 3/4" of steel shock shaft now visible below the bumpstop and a 500% improved driving quality. (Maybe I can coax my wife back into the car again!) I am far more satisfied now - even with the shot shox.

Further Observations

1) The springs: The front springs with the weight of the car on them compress to nearly 1/2 of their relaxed height. With the perches removed, the seat adjustment would have to be at nearly the very top of the sleeve in order to gain 1" or more of possible wheel motion before hitting the bumpstops. It's just an interesting tradeoff for a spring that is supposed to allow lowering of the car AND driveability, by using such a short (or low rate?) spring, Arospeed shoots themselves in the foot by limiting the reasonable adjustability range.

2) Adjusters: With the perches cut, the adjusters having been raised 3/8", the front ones are now about 3/4" from the top of the sleeve (yes - if the struts would permit it, the front could be dropped another full 3"!), the rears are 3/8" from the bottom. On both the front and the back I have oriented the sleeves such that the set screws are at the top edge (the bores are approx 1/4" from the upper edge of the sleeve). Curiously, the set screws do not recess below the level of the threaded surface, so the last 1/2" or so of the upper threads are unusable... unless of course the set screws are removed (are these really necessary?) Anyway, if I wanted, I could not lift the front ride height by any more than 1/4" now without tearing down the entire assembly and flipping the sleeves over, so my recommendation is that anyone doing a fresh install on these, put the front set screws on the bottom edge, and the rear set screws at the top edge - this will allow a tight drop on the rear and a controlled lift on the front without having to worry about the screws getting in the way.

3) "Top hats"- or whatever the stoopid things are called that go on top of the coilover springs (comes with them, not an OE part) I suddenly realize why the springs in the kit are marked for front & back - I didn't get this at first because everything looked identical front & back, but I figured I'd better not question it in case the springs were different rates or something, so I kept the front-to-back relationship as directed - good thing to as I discovered today the difference: the top hats for the front have a recess on top of them that perfectly fit the strut bearing - the rears do not. All the other parts it would see, however, are identical.

Thanks for everyone's input!

[tracer bullet]

Glad you got it figured out. If / when you spring for new struts, I think you'll see another huge improvement as big as what you got raising it off the bumpstops.

Getting it off the stops certainly helps soak up the bumps, so the initial hits aren't as bad. Getting good struts will help make that just be one hit, as opposed to a couple of bounces following afterwards.

The way you mention the front springs being set near the top - If you run out of strut travel right now before you get the springs to coilbind, you're doing OK. But - if your springs do coilbind first, which could really lead to problems, you may have the option of getting newer springs of the same rate but maybe an inch or two longer. You could set the lower perch a little further down the collar, which would keep the same ride height but gain the distance the spring could compress before it bound up. May not have any problems though...

It would be nice to have short struts, wouldn't it? I wonder why no one makes them?

[skelly]

Originally posted by tracer bullet
Getting good struts will help make that just be one hit, as opposed to a couple of bounces following afterwards.

Yep, that's where I'm at now, but at least it's tolerable.. riding on the stops was brain-rattling (literally)

The way you mention the front springs being set near the top - If you run out of strut travel right now before you get the springs to coilbind, you're doing OK. But - if your springs do coilbind first, which could really lead to problems, you may have the option of getting newer springs of the same rate but maybe an inch or two longer. You could set the lower perch a little further down the collar, which would keep the same ride height but gain the distance the spring could compress before it bound up. May not have any problems though...

Yeah.. I have about 3/4 to 1" of strut, but about 1.5" of spring left, so I think I'm good there, though that had never really struck me `til you mentioned it...

It would be nice to have short struts, wouldn't it? I wonder why no one makes them?

No doubt.. I was thinking the same thing, but thinking about this, spada's recent "ghetto camber" post and another posting I read a while back about re-drilling holes has me thinking:

why not a bracket that mounts to the spindle in place of the strut and has the strut mounted to it further down (1/2"? More? not sure what's left in there without looking it over more closely) This combined with one of the holes being slotted (an arced slot, actually rather than straight) would permit not only further strut extension, but also some adjustment of the camber (via the slot) without sacrificing integrity by using smaller bolts. This, of course, would only work for coilover setups since you can't really get the lower spring perch much closer to the wheel without rubbing - though I suppose it might work with careful measurement and no over-sized wheels)..

whaddya think? seems pretty straight forward to me...

[MHH]

What should i do???

Hey guys i have arospeeds with 450 fronts and 350 rears! Should i even bother to put these own on my car or not??? I am confused now...i didnt have any idea about the spring rates when i got these...but this post is freaking me out...i dont want my baby to be all bouncy,....help suggestion!

[skelly]

Bouncy shouldn't be much prob if your shox are still in good shape - at least for a while.. it's pretty brutal on them, so you may need better `n OE shox to perform well..

[skelly]

Anybody catch this? Would like some feedback before I start experimenting on it and doing something blatently stupid..

Originally posted by skelly

why not a bracket that mounts to the spindle in place of the strut and has the strut mounted to it further down (1/2"? More? not sure what's left in there without looking it over more closely) This combined with one of the holes being slotted (an arced slot, actually rather than straight) would permit not only further strut extension, but also some adjustment of the camber (via the slot) without sacrificing integrity by using smaller bolts. This, of course, would only work for coilover setups since you can't really get the lower spring perch much closer to the wheel without rubbing - though I suppose it might work with careful measurement and no over-sized wheels)..

whaddya think? seems pretty straight forward to me...

[Rayman]

450 and 350? thats stiff......

[MHH]

Originally posted by Rayman
450 and 350? thats stiff......

How does the spring rates work? The higher the stiffer or the other way ??? What the stock spring rates anyways? I have a 95 base!

[MHH]

TTT

[Rayman]

the higher the rate, the stiffer the springs.....i just read in my mag that the rx7 in it has a racing suspension setup with springs rates of 600s in front and 700s in the rear.....THATS fully racing setup......as far as stock, im not sure, but the GCs standard rates for street use are 350 and 250 - front and rear