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Old May 12th, 2002, 07:26 AM   #1
190km/h
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Lightbulb I feel it HOT HOT HOT!

I've been having a few minor issues with thermal management.

It was fairly sunny and warm (mid 20s) out today, and I had the misfortune of having to deliver in my Probe for a change. For those who don't know, Kamloops is composed of hills, hills, and more hills. Anyway, the temperature gauge has been creeping above the "Normal" text occasionally when I'm moving slow, so I'm going to put some water wetter and a colder thermostat in there ASAP. I'm going to try taking out the weather stripping today because I'm too cheap to put proper hood vents in right now.

But here's the cool part.

After a particularly hard burn up the hill, I pulled over and popped the hood just to make sure everything was fine to be greeted by a warm glow from my engine bay. Looking down I notice it is coming from the front heat shield and the pipe proceeding down from it. I looked under the car and the pipe was glowing a nice bright orange right up to the point where it joins the other header pipe. It stayed hot for quite a while too, but once it had cooled off I checked a number of times that night and didn't find any more glowing (except for the drive immediately after, also a hard burn up the hill).

The question is, should I be concerned? I was watching my EGTs the whole night, and on the run in question my EGTs never went over ~1350 degrees. As I understand it, anything up to ~1500 is normal. The EGT is tapped right off the front pipe, 2 inches down from the header... an area that was glowing nicely. I was unable to verify if the rear bank was running that hot as well. No pinging, no knocking, normal drivability. Air fuel ratio gauge didn't act any differently than it normally does, still goes nice and rich on WOT. Fuel pressure at 4 psi is 70 psi. FMU signal is tapped off the compressor outlet, so it sees more boost than the engine ever does. Most of the time, I'm only getting ~2 psi, due to some hardcore wastegate creepage. My ignition timing is retarded 7 degrees at the moment IIRC.

My theory is that the retarded timing is resulting in higher than normal EGTs at times (I crept above 1500 a few times on the highway a few weeks ago) because the exhaust is still burning when it exits the chamber.

I'm driving to Vancouver this afternoon... does anybody think this is reason enough to take a different car?
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Old May 12th, 2002, 11:46 AM   #2
190km/h
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Update: I pulled the plugs on the front bank, they're all perfect. Nice caramel color, no speckling (well, a few small dark spots on the center plug, but nothing to worry about), no cracking or aluminum bits on them.

The weather stripping came right off, much easier than I had anticipated. I definitely recommend this mod, as I can feel the hot air coming out with my hand, and the BOV is much louder now.

Water wetter is in as well, although I'm not sure if it has circulated yet. I put it in the usual fill area because I couldn't get the radiator cap off, so I dunno if it is actually in the system.

Wish me luck people... I'm goin to Van.
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2005 Australian Shepherd: Named "Turbo," missing testicle weight reduction, no other mods planned
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Old May 12th, 2002, 12:32 PM   #3
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Re: I feel it HOT HOT HOT!

Quote:
Originally posted by 190km/h


FMU signal is tapped off the compressor outlet, so it sees more boost than the engine ever does.
Hmmmm... I have never even thought about this. I have my S-FMU tapped to the vacuum line that goes to the stock FPR unit. Would this really make any difference? If it will, then I'll have to do something about it and get it tapped on the compressor outlet line also. That might help me to get my fuel pressure up sooner than now...

Thanks
Mici
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Old May 13th, 2002, 08:09 AM   #4
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Re: Re: I feel it HOT HOT HOT!

Quote:
Originally posted by deejayarse


Hmmmm... I have never even thought about this. I have my S-FMU tapped to the vacuum line that goes to the stock FPR unit. Would this really make any difference? If it will, then I'll have to do something about it and get it tapped on the compressor outlet line also. That might help me to get my fuel pressure up sooner than now...

Thanks
Mici
190km/h. Thank You Thank You Thank You!!! I tapped my S-FMU vacuum/boost line on the wastegate actuator signal line. I now not only see higher fuel pressures on lower boost but ALSO I see the fuel pressure rising a lot of quicker than it used to.

This was one of the best hints I have had with my turbo install, no doubt. If I'd live closer, I'd come by and hand you a box of chocolate and a bush of flowers!

Seriously, anybody, who is boosting with aftermarket or custom turbo system, tap your FMU line on the wastegate actuator signal line. You'll have a lot more fuel to burn with that compressed air.

*Bows deep down to 190km/h*

This is why I love to spend my time reading on threads in forced induction forum. You never know what you might find. See, I wasn't looking for cure to this, I was just intrested of seeing what you had in mind.

Thanks (enough thanks said yet?? )

Mici
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Old May 13th, 2002, 09:40 AM   #5
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Re: I feel it HOT HOT HOT!

Quote:
Originally posted by 190km/h
My theory is that the retarded timing is resulting in higher than normal EGTs at times (I crept above 1500 a few times on the highway a few weeks ago) because the exhaust is still burning when it exits the chamber.
In the new TEC 3 manual, there are some relavant notes about timing advance, EGT's, and glowing exhausts.

The TEC 3 manual says, "Less timing makes the combustion process occur later, and thus makes the exhaust temperatures higher." They also note, that if your "exhaust manifold is glowing red at idle, you know one thing: there is not enough timing." This last note only refers to idle. At higher rpms, high boost, and high loads, much more fuel is burned. Thus, I wouldn't be surprised if you could get the exhaust to glow even if the timing was OK.

But, if it is abnormal to see this, then you're probably on track to look at increased fuel allowing increased timing.

Let us know how the mod you mentioned above affects the same drive next time. I'd like to know if that warm glow goes away.
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Old February 2nd, 2003, 03:34 PM   #6
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How'd this come out?

Nick
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Old February 2nd, 2003, 08:28 PM   #7
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how is your oil pressure? Is your turbo being oiled properly?

when was the last time you checked coolant levels?
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Old February 3rd, 2003, 02:08 PM   #8
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How'd it turn out?

It never happened again. I'm going to check my timing this week though, because I know my mechanic retarded it when he installed the turbo. The car has had overheating problems ever since, and the best time I've gotten out of it was a 14.9... something is definitely wrong here.

Wish me luck!
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1996 PGT-Tze: ZE, T3/T4 turbo, 24" FMIC, Fidanza, Clutchmasters Stage III, Megasquirt'n'Spark, AEM Wideband
1993 MX-6 LS: Bone stock, pimped out with leather and 2 stereos
2005 Australian Shepherd: Named "Turbo," missing testicle weight reduction, no other mods planned
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Old February 3rd, 2003, 03:31 PM   #9
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Glowing manifolds is normal under hard driving with most turbo cars. I have seen stock Supra and Mitsu manifolds glowing almost see thru hot before.
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Old February 3rd, 2003, 04:57 PM   #10
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I'm curious as to what the rest of you have in temperatures under the hood, glowing pipes and whatever else seems relevant. I've never seen my pipes turn any color other than the black ceramic high temp. coating on them. Of course the coating seems to be serving its purpose, but I've pushed the car up to top end three times now, pulled over and popped the hood immediatly after doing it twice, and other than heat, I've never any physical properties of heat expansion.seen
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