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2nd Gen (93-97) V6 2.5L Discussion of Maint Issues for V6

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Old February 2nd, 2018, 09:34 PM   #1
stoker100
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retarding cam timing with larger idler pulley

Myself and a friend both have ZE's with shaved heads (of an unknown amount) and manual timing belt tensioners (which are pretty much maxed out). We also both have DE like low down torque and uninspiring power up top. Im currently replacing my water pump at the moment and to correct the timing its just another bolt and a little time using a larger diameter front tensioner pulley.

The plan is to fit a bigger tensioner to retard the timing "roughly" back to stock, sure it wont help with the rear bank (as much) but its worth a try. Ill be using the very unscientific method of releasing the tensioner, slipping in a known thickness sleeve between the belt and tensioner and then tightening it up to determine the new pulley diameter. Both the crank and a cam will have a degree wheel to see the effect of the sleeve on timing, looking for approx 3deg minimum to 5deg maximum.

Is this a crazy idea? Is there a better suggestion? fire away
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Old February 3rd, 2018, 04:01 AM   #2
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Adjustable cam gears.

They are pretty hard to find though.
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Old February 3rd, 2018, 09:42 AM   #3
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Head gasket shims are another option, but would require knowing/estimating how much the heads were shaved. And removing the heads of course.
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Old February 3rd, 2018, 11:33 AM   #4
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Adjustable cam gears.

They are pretty hard to find though.
Why spend $$$$ if it works with a larger pulley? Ive looked for abour 3 years now for the cam gears and cant find them.

Head gasket shims are even more work and as you say you need to know how much was taken off.
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Old February 3rd, 2018, 12:57 PM   #5
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Thought about re-indexing a stock set of gears by cutting new slots in the center? Not sure if this is a possibility, but free is always good if it can work. Level of measuring and thinking effort - High. Cost and physical effort - Low.
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Old February 3rd, 2018, 01:31 PM   #6
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Thought about re-indexing a stock set of gears by cutting new slots in the center? Not sure if this is a possibility, but free is always good if it can work. Level of measuring and thinking effort - High. Cost and physical effort - Low.
yes i have thought about doing that, not sure how to go about it to get the precision required and still more effort then what im trying to do (pulley should be <$30 and requires no custom work hopefully).
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Old February 3rd, 2018, 01:41 PM   #7
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Can't you still get them at cfk in the UK? (pullies)
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Old February 3rd, 2018, 01:45 PM   #8
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Can't you still get them at cfk in the UK? (pullies)
Do you mean CDF racing? pretty sure its listed on the site but when i checked they didn't make them anymore (i may be wrong as this was a while ago).
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Old February 3rd, 2018, 02:06 PM   #9
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Do you mean CDF racing? pretty sure its listed on the site but when i checked they didn't make them anymore (i may be wrong as this was a while ago).

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Old February 3rd, 2018, 08:39 PM   #10
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anyone have any comments on the original post idea instead of alternative options?
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Old February 4th, 2018, 04:31 PM   #11
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anyone have any comments on the original post idea instead of alternative options?
http://www.cdfracing.co.uk/product_i...roducts_id=599

The CDF web page holds a listing for Mazda KL series cam pulleys but the price is...... 160.00 pounds!!!!
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Old February 4th, 2018, 04:45 PM   #12
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http://www.cdfracing.co.uk/product_i...roducts_id=599

The CDF web page holds a listing for Mazda KL series cam pulleys but the price is...... 160.00 pounds!!!!
You havent been reading the posts have you?
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Old February 4th, 2018, 05:55 PM   #13
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So many shaved head threads asking how to fix the after effects. It’s like nobody thinks ahead anymore. I’ve never shaved or had the need back when I was active.
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Old February 4th, 2018, 06:25 PM   #14
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My head was slightly warped so it had to be shaved, i immediately thought about the timing but didnt have the time back then to address the issue which is why im looking at it now. Better late than never right.
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Old February 5th, 2018, 09:24 AM   #15
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There’s a service limit like .004”
The one time I threw a head away from warping was the time I put MS on my daily on a 300 mile trip and attempting to get “world record” mpg. I leaned it out until it started to shake and blew a geyser !! After pulling the spark plug out , I got my compression tester hose seized in the head from it contracting on cool down.
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Old February 5th, 2018, 01:53 PM   #16
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This site needs a section for stories like this. Not kill stories, more like a WTH happened.
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Old February 5th, 2018, 02:43 PM   #17
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This site needs a section for stories like this. Not kill stories, more like a WTH happened.
This is 100% happening, pulley is off and i have measured up the size required to retard the cam timing the desired amount. Should be back together and running in 2-3 weeks. This has been done before with an adjustable pulley and good results.
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Old February 5th, 2018, 04:17 PM   #18
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I think something was misunderstood. I just meant I was entertained by mac1's story and there should be a section for that. Not doubting you one bit stoker100.
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Old February 5th, 2018, 05:56 PM   #19
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Never used the manual tb tensioner but couldn't you use a longer bolt and remove the slack there? Maybe a cam bolt of some sort on the idler to remove the slack?
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Old February 5th, 2018, 07:10 PM   #20
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Np BLUEnoEQ, sorry for the confusion.

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Never used the manual tb tensioner but couldn't you use a longer bolt and remove the slack there? Maybe a cam bolt of some sort on the idler to remove the slack?
The tensioner does not effect the timing, i only mentioned it because you can see the tensioner is almost at its limits after shaving the head. Im taking about the pulley on the other side behind the dipstick.
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Old February 6th, 2018, 07:58 AM   #21
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Hmmm....sounds like my cam olt idea would work...or both the idler are same diameter so you can maybe split the diff between them and tighten it up. Could also make new alignment spots upon cam install so they're in the correct spot. Would work like adjustable cam gears...just way more of a pita. Idk if it was me I'd make the shop who milled them but me new ones for butchering the job and not using a spec sheet to know where you stand.
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Old February 6th, 2018, 10:17 PM   #22
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NP. Don't the heads have a spot that tells you how much meat there is to shave? It looks like a recessed circle. There was a 4G63 video I saw a while back where the guy pointed it out and then I saw it on one of my heads. I'm not confident in the adjustment or shimming of spinny parts.

What about welding in the cam pin slot on the timing pulley and then drilling out a new hole forward or aft where you want it on each pulley? Edit: OR enlarge the cam pulley slot in the direction you want to go and sleeve the cam pin itself to remove any slop.
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Old February 7th, 2018, 06:02 AM   #23
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I would maybe consider the cdf pulleys if they are still available. That way you had them and if there were a time down the road something came up to where you wish you had them and they are no longer available. Might be an easier job and it says they are a little lighter which will reduce rotational power loss (who knows how much our even noticeable) but definitely something I myself would consider. 160# I believe it's around $200 then it would be good to go.

Although some of the other ideas on here sounds like they should work as well so you have a little to think about.
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Old February 7th, 2018, 10:58 AM   #24
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I would maybe consider the cdf pulleys if they are still available.
You havent been reading the posts have you?
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Old February 7th, 2018, 11:34 AM   #25
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If it were my car I'm just giving the direction I would go personally. Or as was mentioned above I would go back to the shop that did not supply you with a spec sheet. If anything was on any paperwork it should at the very least show what was milled off. Make them figure out the timing correction since they did not give you a direct number to work with.

Just my .02
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