Difference between ZE & DE

[klde94]

I think i can beat a ZE

[RigsPGT]

Hmmm, id say give both cars the same mods, you might be surprised how each one reacts
I've raced a friend with a ZE on my DE several times and always put 1/2-1CL on him and kept it that way until shutting down.
My mods were:
-new DE engine with only 20k at the time
-ZE im with 65mm TB and ported spacers
-MS with stock O2 sensor (running rich)
-Hot Shot headers
-Pacessetter exhaust
-Aeromotive AFPR
-Millenia S injectors (was getting ready for turbo)
-MX3 fw with OFE SB clutch
-WAI with 2.5" short pipe
-MSD 6A with ZE disty and coil blaster 2
-walbro 255lph

His mods were exactly the same minus the 65mm TB and ported spacers. He also had AEM wideband to tune the AFRs and far better tune than mine. His car got a 14.8 at the track just so you know the ZE was running in tip top shape. After the runs we went back looking for anything going wrong with his ZE, but everything was clean including compression.
In conclusion, ZEs are fun but dont overate them soo much! BTW, I had a ZE back in 02 till 05 so i know how they feel!

[siknin]

there is his problem. going by the mod list you would be faster. ZE's are over rated.

No Ze's are not over rated. Just make sure the ze is in good shape and has the right tuning or ecu/chip. A good running ze will beat a good running de


My de with the same mods as my ze was slower. I ran consistent 14.5s 2.2 60fts with i/h/e, ze ecu on street tires full interior.

Now if had MS back then and a cutout i imagine with a tune on MS I would have been faster. Probably would have been another 13sec all motor ze but I chose to boost. And my ze swap is like 7years old.

If you get a ze thats in good shape you will be really satisfied well at least untill boost or spray ideas get into your head

[j-dogg]

That Mustang probably would have got ate by that ZE

All you guys thinking about the ZE swap make sure you drop the oil pan and check for sludge, some of those motors have been sitting on the shelf for years because of the economy.

[turbo2383]

nice vid! i like mustangs...but that guy looked like a fool

[slinkyPgT]

such an awesome difference. Man. I should find a DE around here and do a comparison vid and post it up.

awesome!

im game!!! your ZE to my DE.... lolz.

[tour96se]

i've seen de's keep up with ze's...theres alot of factors that come into play here

[ArchAngel283]

Perfect example... my DE kept up with KLZEYA's ZE he had in his old MX6... but his ZE in his Probe...different story. Better ZE in the Probe. Depends on each individual ZE. Some are good....some are bad... ZEYA knows. LOL he's been thru a few of them.

[pgt4speed]

If you get a ze thats in good shape you will be really satisfied well at least untill boost or spray ideas get into your head

Exactly, I am almost 10 years on my ZE swap.

[mike_bus]

Speaking from owning... The Ze with the right tune & chip, will out run a real good running De. I've had both and my car is scary fast compared to me fast de I had that ran real good!

[KLZE Porsche]

I believe like KLZEporsche, that a DE will be stronger than a ZE with the same mods, because you can port them more, and the valvetrain is stronger.

I never said that you could port them more. I said you could port them to flow more through a more efficient port shape because you have more material to work with. And as for DE against ZE - it does totally depend upon so many different variables on how the engine is built and how well it is tuned.

If I had the same DE engine built that I ran several years ago - there isn't a ZE with stock pistons, rods, cams, valve train that I would have traded it for because I have never put together a ZE component motor yet that could stand up to that beast. I would love to build another one just like it and perhaps I will shortly if I get the time to mess with it.

[Dave24v]

Although the ZE is faster with better torque and horses than the DE, ... Yet the ZE is no good for boost (Supercharger) because of it's high compression and weaker springs & retainers, ... So if your looking at boosting your Probe, then DON'T go for a ZE!! Go for a DE or Hybrid! ;-)

That's another difference for ya to compare the 2 with ;-)

[mattm]

Dude you guys have got to be kidding me with this CRAP!!!! I have never even owned a ze but Ill tell you that I know for a FACT a good one would rape my de without boost and always would have.

There are guys on here dynoing damn near 200whp (Westpalm was!) on a ze with ms! You CAN"T do that with boltons from a de its just not possible.

You guys are talking about BUILDING a DE! Obviously if you take about a block and heads and do extensive work to them yes you might have a de that could beat a ze, but why would you do that if you could just buy a ze put de springs and retainers in it and call it a day!

You can (and it has been done) put boost to a ze it just requires a good tune that is all!

So please people tell me how a bolt on ms'd ze that makes 200whp is over rated? Show me one bolt on de with ms makeing that kind of power! I never even knocked on the door of 170whp with boltons and ms on my de.

[fowljesse]

Sorry for the misquote, KLZE Porsche. It came out wrong.
As for building a DE; it's not for everyone. I like being the underdog. That's why I bought the MX-3 in the first place. Then, to go further, my goal is to build a N/A DE with VRIS intact that can compare to the strongest built N/A ZEs with VRIS intact. ZEs are a perfect choice for swap in, bolt on power, but if you have the ability, I believe that with work, DEs can be built stronger, just because of the head, and G4 IM design. My DE is basically a ZE clone pushed further.

[KLZE Porsche]

Dude you guys have got to be kidding me with this CRAP!!!! I have never even owned a ze but Ill tell you that I know for a FACT a good one would rape my de without boost and always would have.

Matt,

I don't think anyone is talking about a DE vs. ZE with only the same bolt-ons. The subject goes much deeper than that. I have said that for a N/A engine with similar bolt-ons that the ZE would be the better choice. Others have said that the DE would be a better choice for boosted because of the higher rate valvesprings and thus a higher RPM limit to make more power up top before dropping valves.

But if you were to boost stock KLZE heads with DE springs vs stock DE heads then the ZE would definitely out-perform the DE.

But if you wanted to port some heads to the max then the DE heads are the better choice to start with because you are not so limited with port shape due to the ZE ports being much larger and giving you less material to work with for a more efficient port design.

Obviously if you take about a block and heads and do extensive work to them yes you might have a de that could beat a ze, but why would you do that if you could just buy a ze put de springs and retainers in it and call it a day!

I am totally with you! If I had no intention of doing head porting work -I would use ZE heads with DE springs and call it a day! But since I do all of my own headwork then I have no need for ZE heads because I know that I can do better with the DE heads. Not only can I make a more efficient flowing port shape and put DE springs in for a higher top end -but I can also use the same 30mm buckets on top of all valves which means that I can run the lighweight hollow core SLAs that I use to raise the top end even more. You can't do that with the ZE heads because -(that I know of) there are no 33mm direct SLA replacements for the uber heavy 33mm hydraulic ones. So that seals it for me!